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Tuesday, November 28, 2006

A question(able?) post

I am sick and tired of hearing about astrologers and horoscopes. Really sick. I don't blame those who practice the profession of astrology alone. I blame myself and millions like me who really can't take a stand on the issue. I can't stand up boldly and say, "Hey, I don't believe you can predict the future. You're a bogus". Neither can I surrender completely and say, "Hey, you are so right. I believe you completely".

It does seem odd to completely give in to a stranger's prediction of my "supposed" future and take decisions based on it. What if he's wrong? What if I make a decision based on it and then it fails completely? Would I blame myself then? Or the astrologer? Do we believe in astrology to feel re-assured about our future? Can someone really "see" the future so certainly? If he sees the future so certainly, isn't he supposed to be God? Well, what's the purpose of God or any actions that we perform in everyday life if everything's already pre-determined? Besides, if one's karma is so strong and we can't really escape it, why bother evading it using astrology?

In short, I've decided that "predicting" the future is a crime and astrologers as a profession should be banned. I think its better to just do what your heart tells you and consequences be damned. If that turns out to be wrong, hey, at least its your own, patented mistake - not some astrologer's. I meant for this post to be a more coherent, meaningful discussion on the truth/falsity of astrology. But I guess what turned it out to be is a confused set of questions...:) Maybe that's exactly what astrology is - a confused set of questionable practices.







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29 comments:

Anonymous said...

I have always felt astrology is not meant to be used to tell you what you should do, all it can do is provide guidance. You have to be responsible for and make the decisions in your life. Everybody's inner voice is their best astrologer, because it somehow intuitively know what the best thing to do is....

SamY said...

horoscope serve good purpose ... physicological as I see it

consider a guy n gal who have no clue as to whome to marry ... but all they know is they just got to ... what r the chances that the too will try to uphold the marriage when its in jeopardy ... I guess it would be more if the horoscope guy said so :) ... dun u think? so its not all that bad

** I've decided that "predicting" the future is a crime and astrologers as a profession should be banned.

next thing ur gonna hit on is stock brokers? therz so much around that works by speculation.

did u realize that in most cases its the mentally weak / failure cases who go for it in desperation ... in seek of hope ... whatz wrong if the astrologer gives a false hope, but actually it helps the person cope up ... it can give hope to ppl who have none :) ... physicological, don't u think?

these r necessary evils in society to keep stray minds in control ... IMHO these are some one the most brilliantly concieved concepts by our ancestors ... although deceptive ;)

as for its misuse ... well, there are so many things being misused ... and this is just one

Subha said...

>>what r the chances that the too will >>try to uphold the marriage when its >>in jeopardy ... I guess it would be >>more if the horoscope guy said so :)

Are you saying that two people will stay together just because a stranger said they would?!!! That seems foolish...

>>next thing ur gonna hit on is stock >>brokers? therz so much around that >>works by speculation.

Does speculation in the stock market ever lead one to choose their spouse or decide the job they want?! :) IMO, people playing the stock market know that most of it is speculation whereas most people who believe in astrology really take him at his word..

Samy, there's nothing wrong with false hope stuff. But basically, it means that you trust the word of someone stranger who chooses to conveniently say what you want to hear...:)

Anonymous said...

The best time to read ones daily astrology is when you go to sleep at night. Thats when you think OK this happened coz it did happen. But when you analyse your day u realize that it 'also' happened and that the daily astrology stuff is a general saying. So far there hasn't been a day in life in which I had just happiness or joy or y not even sorrow. Both come together and you can take the negative and learn from it or you can take the positive and cherish it. But believing in astrology and doin accordingly is a waste of time. An analogy to astrology is worm hole travel. I shall recommend one thing for this question(able) post. Look at 'Dejavu' and there are two possiblities. U consider it as fiction then u shall love the movie. U consider it unbelievable then u wont learn thing... I guess ur astrology now is 'U r gonna read a crap comment from some dumb guy who is really bored in his lab' :) PS sorry abt this crap comment I had given. I have blown my bolts off.

Anonymous said...

Astrology always baffles me. All along in my life, I have been an atheist. But astrology is something that caught my attention when once an astrologer just by looking at the horoscope said a problem in the body which the doctor confirmed later.

Recently when Tsunami occured, I convinced myself against astrology saying that how can so many people have similar horoscopes to meet tragedy on the same day - especially when I saw the mass burial of the dead. But slowly that confidence faded and I started reading "kumudam jothidam" every week! Recently I was planning a big investment in June 2006 and my wife went and consulted an astrolger on her own and he said there is no way it will happen till atleast Dec and even despite my best efforts it has not happened till now. Recently I watched an interview of an astrologer in kumudam website - though I am not convinced either way, it is an interesting watch.
just my two cents.
BTW Subha, I am a fan of your blog, keep Blogging.
Viswa.

Anonymous said...

Yeah ur post is questionable ... the fact that there are no real people sophisticated in such age old techniques doesnt mean that we can question the authenticity of this science.

Anon - I

PS: So now As you say lets do wat we feel and the let the consequence be damned coz we can really do nothing about it !

Anonymous said...

does it even matter? if you're not really concerned about what astrology tells you then why all this fuss?? if you dont care a damn, then let others live as they would like to! just make sure they dont force you too into believing what they believe in! apart from that you really shouldnt have any problems! cos its not yours!

Anonymous said...

a new entrant to ur blog.well written articles particularly arattai in tamil.pl post more on SRIRANGAM ,TRICHY,ur escapeds around the temples of TANJORE. sundar

Anonymous said...

Why dont you try doing something opposite to which the astrologer has told about u. I mean something that wont make an impact in u r life.

When i graduated my mom took my horoscope and the astrologer said that I would only get a job in August, but I got in February.

In another case my friends parents took the horoscope of his to an astrologer and the astrologer told that he would get married only at the age of 32. He was 27 that time and his parents were looking for alliance for him vigorously, but it happened only at 32 for him.

So I would ask u to go by ur instincts rather than aggreeing to what some Mathematician say. Finally it is all DESTINY..what ever has to happen will happen..believe in Destiny and your Instincts

Sridhar said...

Some facts:
Astrology is based on prediction.

Precision of Prediction depends on lot of data and a good sample their analysis and interpretation.

Astrological outcome is not a dictator. It is an advisor to some extent.

What is expected of people who opt for astrological prediction is -- see the outcome, believe in the good things told there, safeguard some not-so-good predictions but never surrender/submit to it.

Astrological predictions, i was told, is based on karma that we have done earlier; so what ever good or bad "act (karma)" we have done is a result of that karma that which we are destined to get -- something like a planned activity. We all know that a planned activity need not always have to happen as planned, something external, over and above the planned, would act on the planned and things might not go as planned. So in this case God can be taken as that "external" to whom if we make determined effort, would override our destiny. Destiny is our make god has the key to change it and it is in our hand to make god change it. That is why even astrologers say that God is there.

PS: In all above I have taken into account of good astrolgers and not counted any bogus. In every field of life there is bogus acts and again it is left to us to leave them aside and be shrewd enough to not get affected by them.

Prabu Karthik said...

sorry for the rant, but i WANTED to write this...

Astrology - this is one profession which we as a society can do well without. The argument that 'some astrologers being bad is no reason to accuse the system' do not make sense to me.

Assuming you are an engineer, and what you’ve built so far falls down one by one, I will suspect your credentials. But if the same happens with group of engineers, I will no longer suspect just your credentials, but the body of knowledge itself. The system is only as good as the people who profess it at a point in time. If there comes a tomorrow where astrologers can really improve our lives, we shall see it then. But for now, its useless.

People can argue that ‘some astrologers are prescient’. My point is, it’s got nothing to do with the body of knowledge that is astrology. They do that with some innate ability of theirs which I honestly don’t know.

Second, there are lot of cultural factors which contribute to astrology’s survival.

We in our culture don’t want our loved ones to face any trouble. Horoscope matching for marriages are in that category IMHO. Never mind that without facing issues, without struggles, we would never truly grow. Horoscope matching is out of fear of seeing the marriage of sons/daughters ending in failures. Have we been successful? No. There are far more dysfunctional arranged marriages than divorces in love marriages.

Also., we as a culture want to avoid a fall, that small mistake here, that setback there. So we fall into astrology which sets us back more than anything else. Just like avoiding risk is the greatest risk.

I know one blogger friend in Chennai who will not go anywhere near the beach, because sometime back, his uncle, who is an astrologer has told him 'unakku thannila gandam'.
I’d say someone who has jala gandam is better off learning to swim rather than avoid water at any cost. Thankfully he takes bath everyday, so….

Lastly, only a person who is spiritually inclined, one who can let go of all that he has, can be free from the clutches of astrology and its cousins. The more you cling on to all your possessions, the more you need to cling on to these things as well. No escape route.

Subha said...

Desiguy,
Actually your comment is not crappy. Made a lot of sense..:)

Viswa,
Thanks..:)Well, err..sometimes I read Kumudham jothidam also!

Anon-I
I don't think I ever said I am questioning the authenticity of the science...

Sriram,

Where's the fuss? Does writing something in my blog count as fuss in your books? :)

Sundar,
welcome..:)

Anon,

I guess its always a 50-50 game, eh? :)

Sridhar,
You made a lot of sense..you're right! :)

Subha said...

PK,
Abbha..vandhutaanya vandhuttaan! :) Glad that at least one person is firmly on my side..Yes, I believe in what you say. We scare the crap out of ourselves by believing the words of some one who might be as erroneous as we are...sigh..

btw, comment ku udane reply pannirukken..i need brownie points! :)

Adiya said...

astrology r any Xlogy about future will work if a divine person tells u something. otherwise is just a turmoil thing. so i have stopped getting into such non-sense. Think Good, Do good things and u will always get good things is my simple key.

Prabu Karthik said...

i wanted to add one more thing to my comment...

nee reply panninadhu enakke aacharyam dhaan.

Anyway, panam adhigama puzhangara idangalil indha madhiri ella nambikayum (astrology, numberology, some other superstitiion) rombo jasthiya irukkum

eg cinema and stock market

namba oor software companies la kooda product name panradhukku munadi idellam parkaraanga!
no wonder Indian IT products suck most of the time!

Muthukumar Puranam said...

jothidam thanai igaz!
-Bharathiyar
Anyway a good jyothish can let u know where u stand according to ur karma, but it is our free will we need to exercise to better ourselves.
Also gnasambandhar, markandeyan ellam proved us shivan bhakthargaluku KOlgalal aabathu illainu. (avai nalla nalla adiyaravarku migave).

Anonymous said...

saw ur welcome note.pl go down ur memory highway and relive the experience of PADIYETRAM(KAISIKA EKADASI)today at SRIRANGAM,iy u had the good fortune to witness during ur darshan of AZAGIYA MANAVALAN .post ur tamil blog uptodate pl.
sundar again

Subha said...

Adiya,
admirably simple and straightforward policy..:) I wish I could follow it all the time...

PK,
u didn't give me any appreciation for responding promptly..! Humph..:( But yeah, point taken..

PB,
Right.

Sundar,
Will try to pen my thoughts soon..

Prabu Karthik said...

APPRECIATED!

next time india va, oru periya paaraatu vizha nadathalaam! :D

Anonymous said...

no no.. what i meant was, people who are out looking for excuses will not be held back. and when you aren't quite in the same mould, its better left to them and not worry.. thats what i meant.. so rather than worry about the insecurities of other people and the means they would like to counter them, relying on/blaming astrological predictions being one of them, i guess we're better off believing in ourselves and backing ourselves to do something right and doing it well..

Anonymous said...

and Sridhar, as you prob know being a maths student yourself, that prediction is a very very difficult thing to do.. even with large amounts of data. hence, rather than predicting erroneously, you might consider not doing it at all... this in light of the fact that you're virtually deciding somebodys life.

Anonymous said...

posted a rejoinder in ur tamil blog on THIRUVIDAIMARUTHUR .pl go throuh and blog during spare time-sorry to bother here as i have no take on JOSHIAM.though i have heard sincere and simple people have lot of faith due to longstanding practice and its accuracy. sundar

Prakash Gomathinayagam said...

well said. don't ever take a chance. I myself is a scape goat. my father believes in astrology very much. my girl friend belongs to different caste, and my father told, if astrology favors us, he is ok. I took a chance and the astrologer tells 'cock and bull story'. for us 8 portuthams are there, but they cling on to 'iru thaara yogam', blah blah. The point is, 'Dont ever take a chance. It is like Lottery', then you have to blame yourself.

dinesh said...

I read your piece and Pk's comments. Have to say, Iagree with both. As much as I have started to disbelieve in horoscopes and as much as it defies logic and common sense, there is a small comfort factor associated with it during troubled times. I have been guilty of using this as a cushion too.

Anonymous said...

Well i really agree with your topic... What is the fun when you know whats going to happen. The fun is live life as it is ... Live everyday as you want to. and not believe on some predictions and assumptions.. Anyway that is how i feel


I still havent got your reviews on my site... Hello tring tring...

Anonymous said...

dear doodle,

sorry to disturb here.

posted 2 comments in ur tamil blog on thruvidaimaruthur .pl go thro in ur spare time and offer ur views.

i will be delighted to have more on srirangam from ur viewpoint,prehaps starting with ANDAL sannidhi pl.

in return,like the bownie points(what is it anyway),u will be getting a lifetime fan for ur blog.

thans for ur blogg- sundar

Sriram C S said...

Hmm...loads of comments already! I have a real life story that might make sense with this post. I meet this girl online after she read my blog. Three days later I'm head over heels with her...she thanksfully reciprocates. Eight months later when our marriage is to be arranged, our parents take up the horoscopes. I have this gut feeling, this voice that kept saying to me 'She is the one' from the start. So I tell my parents 'Check out the horoscope if you want to.'

The astrologer takes one look at our horoscopes and says 'You can't find a better match even if you search through a thousand horoscopes.' Now, for an astrologer it might have been mathematics and stars. For my parents it might have been divine word, culture, tradition, their children's future, etc.,

But for us it was love and belief in our love. That I think is the most sensible thing to do. After all,
"The world moves for love. It kneels before it in awe."
:)

Subha said...

Sriram,
I got it now..:) You're right but sometimes you'd just like to hear good things from someone..not bad, dire predictions..anyways! Thanks for taking the time to clarify.

Prakash,
I sympathise with you but yeah, lotsa times I find that astrologers say more inauspicious things than auspicious stuff..and in turn, they just upset the person involved or demotivate them so mcuh that I wonder if that was what astrology started out for??

Dinesh,
that is precisely what i am talking about too!:) You look for comfort and you end up getting a bag of thorns..:(

Sundar,
I did read through your comments..haven't really found the time to blog in Tamil. Appreciate your interest..:)

Kishore,
I read through ur blog..didn't leave any comment..sorry about that! Will do right away..

SriramCS,
that's comforting to know!:) Let me offer my congratulations first! :)

Anonymous said...

Here is a nive reading on the Astrology and its use by those who had solved the mystery of life:

http://www.crystalclarity.com/yogananda/chap16.html


here is an excerpt. read full chapter to get more wisdom on astrology:

""Astrology is the study of man's response to planetary stimuli. The stars have no conscious benevolence or animosity; they merely send forth positive and negative radiations. Of themselves, these do not help or harm humanity, but offer a lawful channel for the outward operation of cause-effect equilibriums which each man has set into motion in the past.

"A child is born on that day and at that hour when the celestial rays are in mathematical harmony with his individual karma. His horoscope is a challenging portrait, revealing his unalterable past and its probable future results. But the natal chart can be rightly interpreted only by men of intuitive wisdom: these are few.

"The message boldly blazoned across the heavens at the moment of birth is not meant to emphasize fatethe result of past good and evilbut to arouse man's will to escape from his universal thralldom. What he has done, he can undo. None other than himself was the instigator of the causes of whatever effects are now prevalent in his life. He can overcome any limitation, because he created it by his own actions in the first place, and because he has spiritual resources which are not subject to planetary pressure. "